[Rwp] Understanding Envelope Visibility + Should Something Be Done in Osara?

Sun Nov 22 20:38:10 EST 2015

So I see 2 ways to create a workaround, and both of them have a rather nasty 
margin of error, but I'm putting them out here, just in case this sparks 
something more refined by someone else.1.  Creat
e
 a macro bound to up/down arrow for previous and next track selection, which 
hides all envelopes, selects the previous/next track, then shows all visible 
envelopes for the selected track.
I could see this one breaking effects quite badly under some conditions, but 
it should otherwise work.

2.  Creat an action that renames track/item/envelope depending on selection, 
then have osara simply announce the name of the selected envelope.  This 
would mean that it would be up to the individual to name things logically, 
otherwise, nothing changes.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "James Teh" <jamie at nvaccess.org>
To: "Reapers Without Peepers" <rwp at bluegrasspals.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 22, 2015 3:31 PM
Subject: Re: [Rwp] Understanding Envelope Visibility + Should Something Be 
Done in Osara?

> Hmm. I assumed that the Track: Select next/previous envelope actions were 
> specific to the currently selected track. However, this doesn't appear to 
> be the case. That's actually very frustrating and IMO a bit silly. I guess 
> a sighted user only displays a couple of envelopes at a time.
>
> What I can tell you, though, is that those actions don't select envelopes 
> that aren't visible. If you toggle the volume envelope visible, you can 
> select it, but if you toggle it again, you can't.
>
> From what I can see, there's no way to get the track associated with a 
> given envelope. There is this weird envelope parameter for tracks, but 
> note the singular "envelope", not "envelopes". Also, even if that did work 
> somehow, I'd have to search every track to find the envelope, which is 
> horribly inefficient.
>
> Jamie
>
> On 23/11/2015 5:06 AM, Scott Chesworth wrote:
>> So far as I understand it, the API doesn't seem to output any
>> specifics of what track an envelope belongs to. But hey, there's every
>> chance I'm understanding things wrong. Jamie will know for sure, so
>> get it on GitHub.
>>
>> Scott
>>
>> On 11/22/15, Matej Golian <matej.golian at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Thanks for the valuable info, Scott. Now I finally get it. :D
>>> I thought about it more and I will certainly make a Github request
>>> sometime soon. I thought of an alternative solution. Maybe it can't be
>>> done this way either, but it's worth a try. I wonder whether Osara
>>> could potentially identify which track a particular envelope belongs
>>> to, if it was selected. If it could, perhaps an Osara configuration
>>> option could be added to also announce the track name when cycling
>>> through all the visible envelopes. I guess this would be more than
>>> enough. Maybe it's the same thing as cycling only between envelopes of
>>> a particular track and it therefore might not work, but I guess Jamie
>>> will have to be the judge of that. :D
>>>
>>> 2015-11-22 18:36 GMT+01:00, Scott Chesworth <scottchesworth at gmail.com>:
>>>> So far as I know, there's no info provided by the Reaper API that
>>>> OSARA can use to display envelopes specific to the track you're
>>>> currently on, hence why OSARA cycles envelopes for all tracks at the
>>>> moment. I think it's worth opening as an issue on GitHub though. Worst
>>>> that might happen is that Jamie will look into it, explain why it
>>>> can't be done if he can't find a way to hack around the limitation,
>>>> and close the issue. Even if that happens, you'll have a bit more
>>>> insight into the problem and could potentially take that to the Reaper
>>>> developers and ask for specific improvements to their API in this
>>>> area.
>>>>
>>>> Scott
>>>>
>>>> On 11/22/15, Matej Golian <matej.golian at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> Thanks a lot. Now I have one more thing to experiment with. :D
>>>>> Hope someone can say more about this though as it is still very 
>>>>> unclear
>>>>> to
>>>>> me.
>>>>>
>>>>> 2015-11-22 15:32 GMT+01:00, onlineeagle via RWP 
>>>>> <rwp at bluegrasspals.com>:
>>>>>> Hi, I am very new to this this, but in answer to your first question, 
>>>>>> I
>>>>>> believe Shipt O will only show the envelopes on the track you're
>>>>>> focused
>>>>>> on.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 21 Nov 2015, at 11:22, Matej Golian <matej.golian at gmail.com> 
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi again folks,
>>>>>>> it's nothing urgent, because I don't need to work with envelopes 
>>>>>>> yet,
>>>>>>> but I'll most likely do something with them in the future. 
>>>>>>> Regardless
>>>>>>> I'm trying to understand how they work.
>>>>>>> Could someone please explain to me how toggling envelope visibility
>>>>>>> works? Specifically, I'd like to know the relationship between
>>>>>>> selecting tracks and switching between active envelopes. The thing I
>>>>>>> can't understand is this.
>>>>>>> Say I have a project with 2 tracks. I move to the first track, press
>>>>>>> ctrl+alt+v and than verify with ctrl+l that the volume envelope is
>>>>>>> indeed active.
>>>>>>> Next I move to the second track and press ctrl+alt+p to make the pan
>>>>>>> envelope visible. This works as well, but I can't understand why
>>>>>>> ctrl+l always switches between the volume and pan envelopes 
>>>>>>> regardless
>>>>>>> of the currently focused track. I thought that it would only give me
>>>>>>> the volume envelope when the first track has focus and only the pan
>>>>>>> envelope when the second track has focus. So, does ctrl+l switch
>>>>>>> between envelopes across all tracks or am I going about this all
>>>>>>> wrong?
>>>>>>> My second question is, how well do envelopes work with the new
>>>>>>> focusable master track (switching, toggling and so on)? Does it
>>>>>>> already behave like any other track when it has focus using Osara or
>>>>>>> does further 'envelope support' have to be added? Also would it be
>>>>>>> useful if the master track responded to the Track: View Envelopes 
>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>> Current Track action or is this irrelevant in case of the master
>>>>>>> track?
>>>>>>> I would file an issue On Github, but first I have to understand how
>>>>>>> envelopes work. Or maybe someone who frequently uses them could do 
>>>>>>> it
>>>>>>> instead. Just a thought.
>>>>>>> Thanks in advance.
>>>>>>> Matej
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> -- 
> James Teh
> Executive Director, NV Access Limited
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