[Rwp] My! Lord! am I impressed!

Mon Apr 6 15:24:27 EDT 2015

This is another factor that contributed to my "surfaces in Reaper
suck" outburst. In Pro Tools (the DAW I've worked with most
extensively using a surface), it seems like keyboard, mouse and
surfaces are all keeping track of each other, so it's easy to switch
to a different input method half way through a task if that's what
makes you the most efficient. Haven't seen enough to know whether it's
the same in Sonarville, but given that JSonar implements a fake
surface to get a lot of it's stuff done, I'd imagine it would be. I
keep expecting Reaper to behave the same way, but instead find myself
burning time trying to figure out where each input method was left the
last time I used it.

FWIW, I'm all in favour of your fake focus on the master track
approach, because I reckon it actually brings us closer in line with
the UX of sighted users. When the master track is showing, they see it
at the top of the TCP. I dunno how many users still go digging around
in the actions list once they've got a thorough keymap sorted out, but
I think that so long as the hack was documented, it probably wouldn't
trip many people up. I mean, if they're advanced enough users to be
chaining/creating fresh actions, they're probably smart enough to read
the documentation or ask here when stuff doesn't work out. This is
only based on my usage really. I find myself examining individual
actions once in a blue moon when I'm using a good keymap.

Scott

On 4/6/15, James Teh via RWP <rwp at bluegrasspals.com> wrote:
> Yup, that's what I expected. Last touched, selected and current surface
> tracks are all separate concepts. I guess this sort of makes sense,
> especially given the possibility of multiple tracks on a surface.
>
> As for the separate actions, yeah, they're separate in the API too. Also, as
> far as the API is concerned, there's not much difference between normal
> tracks and the master; you deal with them in the same way.
>
> I think you can set the last touched track by clicking with the mouse as
> well. Actually, that gives me an interesting idea I need to try... :)
>
> I've considered adding a command to fake focus the master track for OSARA
> commands so we can avoid having separate commands for normal and master
> tracks for FX parameters, virtual nav, etc. However, the problem is that
> this could be confusing because it would only apply to OSARA commands, not
> REAPER and SWS commands.
>
> Jamie
>
>
> Sent from a mobile device
>
>> On 7 Apr 2015, at 12:56 am, Scott Chesworth via RWP
>> <rwp at bluegrasspals.com> wrote:
>>
>> Just done some testing here, and you're right, actions intended for
>> the last touched track don't apply to the master track, even when the
>> master is focused as far as a surface is concerned. Guess there's a
>> distinction being made between focused and actually selected too,
>> seeing as ReaAccess reports that nothing is selected every time I bank
>> left to get to the master track. It also seems that keyboard is king
>> over surface in the pecking order, because all of the last touched
>> type actions I tried were applying themselves to whatever the keyboard
>> touched last, rather than which track the surface thought it was
>> working with. Checking the undo history, I realised that the surface
>> was triggering an entirely different set of actions, most of which had
>> "(via surface)" at the end of them. Perhaps interestingly though, the
>> undo points also showed that when it comes to muting, soloing and
>> toggling FX bypass, the same "Adjust track mute (via surface)" actions
>> were being used, irrespective of whether the master track was the one
>> I happened to be working with at the time.
>>
>> Woo, messy! Not sure if that's what you expected. Shout if there's
>> anything else to investigate.
>>
>> Scott
>>
>>
>>> On 4/6/15, James Teh via RWP <rwp at bluegrasspals.com> wrote:
>>> Just to be absolutely certain, can you clarify what makes you say its
>>> focused? I don't doubt you can manipulate master track parameters from
>>> the
>>> surface, but are there any indications other than this? For example, do
>>> actions that describe themselves as working on the last touched track
>>> suddenly start working on the master? The reason I ask is that I didn't
>>> think a surface affected REAPER's idea of the last touched track as far
>>> as
>>> keyboard was concerned, especially because on most surfaces; you're
>>> working
>>> with multiple tracks at once.
>>>
>>>
>>> Sent from a mobile device
>>>
>>>> On 6 Apr 2015, at 8:19 pm, Scott Chesworth via RWP
>>>> <rwp at bluegrasspals.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Jamie wrote:
>>>> "You can't focus the master track (i.e. make it the last touched
>>>> track), but you can certainly access parameters on it."
>>>> In case you didn't already know, the master track does seem to gain
>>>> focus if you bank left from track 1 using a control surface. I've only
>>>> tinkered briefly, but it seemed to work the same way with both HUI and
>>>> whatever protocol the AlphaTrack uses. Dunno if that info would enable
>>>> you to hack around any of the API annoyances, but shout if there's any
>>>> testing to be done and I'll hook a surface up.
>>>>
>>>> Scott
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> On 4/6/15, James Teh via RWP <rwp at bluegrasspals.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On 6/04/2015 9:03 AM, theoreomonster--- via RWP wrote:
>>>>>> One thing to note here. From what i understand Reaper has no API's
>>>>>> for
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> master track so neither SWS nor any or the reaper access plug ins can
>>>>>> access the master track.
>>>>> That's not quite correct. You can't focus the master track (i.e. make
>>>>> it
>>>>> the last touched track), but you can certainly access parameters on
>>>>> it.
>>>>> Both ReaAccess and OSARA support this to some extent.
>>>>>
>>>>>> However VO sees it and i can use VO keys to do stuff on the master
>>>>>> track
>>>>> Yeah; it's exposed via the accessibility API on Windows too.
>>>>> Unfortunately, REAPER's Windows accessibiliy implementation is
>>>>> somewhat
>>>>> broken/limited, so we can't use it quite as well without a lot of
>>>>> messing about.
>>>>>
>>>>> I assume items/takes aren't exposed on the Mac; i.e. you can't hear
>>>>> what
>>>>> item is selected when you move to it, etc. without opening the Item
>>>>> Properties dialog?
>>>>>
>>>>> Jamie
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> James Teh
>>>>> Email/MSN Messenger/Jabber: jamie at jantrid.net
>>>>> Web site: http://www.jantrid.net/
>>>>> Twitter: jcsteh
>>>>>
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