[RWP] Help with Sinth VSTs

Fri Jan 3 08:22:02 EST 2014

It's great to hear that Logic X is being steadily improved on the Mac
side of things.
Have you actually tried using it?
I'm glad to hear that it's actually improving, because any Google
searches on MacVoiceOver, or any other Mac accessibility related
mailing list, has turned up loads of "Don't use it. Inaccessible."
postings.
I'm also curious, since GarageBand X and Logic X go in hand almost, if
Apple will  do point releases for those as well.
When I last spoke to Apple accessibility (this was right after the
main release of GarageBand X) though, they said "GarageBand
accessibility is limited. Use GarageBand 6."
So I'm curious if that still applies.
Thanks.

On 1/2/14, TheOreoMonster <monkeypusher69 at gmail.com> wrote:
> I’d have to disagree with windows being the only way to go for audio
> productions. Both platforms have their accessibility challenge. Pro Tools
> has been accessible since version 8.0.4 and at no point stopped being so,
> only you had to stick to lion and not use mountain lion. While the new
> Garage band X  may have rendered a few things unusable, it still brought
> plenty of new awesome sounds and the new Drummer  feature which are both
> usable with voice over. Want the old garage band,? It’s still there, it
> never got uninstalled when you upgraded to Garage Band X as they are two
> completely different applications not an upgrade. Look in your applications
> folder for Garage Band 6. If Goldwave is still your speed then Amadeus Pro
> may be more your speed. Oh and Reaper is usable as well, providing you are
> willing to do some leg work, hey someone had to create ReaAccess for windows
> versions didn’t they? So its kind of like having to do that yourself first,
> but not to the same extent.  On windows you are using versions of Sonar and
> Reaper that are years old at this point, on the mac i have recorded and
> mixed stuff in the  latest version of pro tools and Reaper 4. And i even
> used some GB sounds in the process. This isn’t to say one is better than the
> other, But rather, chose your battle and then start fighting the uphilll
> battle. Apple standard core audio driver brigs a lot of stability and cool
> rerouting features that not even ASIO can hold a candle toThough WDM is not
> with out an advantage or two as well. This by the way is why I don’t have
> windows installed on any of my macs, neither in boot camp or in a virtual
> machine. If i could easily switch to windows, I’d never taken the time to
> figure out just how much i could push the boundaries with VoiceOver and the
> mac. It’s still unchartered territory and not a lot about it is documented.
> Yes if you are a pro and run a business, then finding time to switch and
> relearn everything may be hard to come by and you gotta stick with what pays
> the bills.  But If you have time to get under something new, I think you
> could get further with a mac , a control surface and a pro DAW.., partly
> because you don’t need install an accessibility plug in to get it to work,
> Oh and Logic in case anyone cares, Apple has steadily introduced more and
> more accessibility to it since about version 8 and with version 10 even the
> point updates has brought accessibility improvements.
> accessibility at apple.com may not give you a straightforward answer or tell
> you whats fixed, but they do read and pay attention to those emails.
> On Jan 1, 2014, at 2:08 AM, Chris Belle <cb1963 at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>> Hey Keith, you get a gold star and an at a boy from me for remembering
>> that, whatever that's worth ha ha.
>>
>> This is a young fellow who's carefuly done his research, and when he makes
>> a buy, he'll not be disapointed.
>>
>> And he's convinced me that probably in the near future I will have a mac
>> in my life, but only to run mac software, and to experiment with the stuff
>> on the mac end which is slowly becomming more accessible.
>>
>> We've had encouraging developments in the protools arena according to our
>> buddy Nate,
>> and though my clients don't give a rip, I would like to have protools as
>> an option around here just in case.
>>
>> One can never be too prepared as long as that preparation doesn't stop you
>> from actually getting work done.
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Keith Hinton
>> To: Reapers Without Peepers
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 31, 2013 12:07 PM
>> Subject: Re: [RWP] Help with Sinth VSTs
>>
>> I forgot to mention DPC latency. One thing the Macs from I believe
>> 2010 onwars are famous for is high over 1000 plus worth non tweekable
>> values out of control DPC latency. At least when running Windows. You
>> can't tweek it in software, and you can't bring it down in hardware.
>> So ultimately, it doesn't matter what hard-drive RPM you have at all.
>> You'll get dropouts, and other problems  with any realtime audio
>> program like Sonar. Sorry for me just remembering to mention that. But
>> I figured to do that, before you got all excited. So really, think
>> twice. If you want a good machine manufacturer, look at Jim
>> Roseberry's machines over at http://www.studiocat.com
>>
>>
>> On 12/31/13, Indigo <33indigo at charter.net> wrote:
>> > I like synthetic synths myself, and aren't interested in synphonic
>> > instruments, but there's a big orchestra program that some blind users
>> > have accessed for years, something Pocket Orchestra.
>> > It might come with Sonar Producer version, or you may be able to buy it
>> > separately.
>> > Someone here will know its name, and how to get it.
>> > Also, there are hardware modules by Roland and others with very
>> > realistic orchestra instruments.
>> > The Yamaha Motif series are famous for their emulated acoustic
>> > instruments, and they have great access, even a website devoted to
>> > blind
>> > users of Motifs.
>> >
>> > If you read the posts on the most recent mac changes that have
>> > destroyed
>> > most of mac access, you may become wary of struggling with running a
>> > mac.
>> > I envied the beautiful clarity of music made on Logic, until I played a
>> > tutorial video done by TC Helicon on how to edit a tiny little track
>> > from 1 of their pedals in Logic on a mac.
>> > The guy was a expert mac user, and a factory tech, and it took hours,
>> > plus a dozen reboots to get a few little track edits done in Logic.
>> > Mac owners will never reveal those flaws to you, they have paid so much
>> > for their macs; and the snob appeal is so great;  they just keep quiet
>> > and eat it.
>> >
>> > Indi
>> >
>> > On 12/30/2013 6:40 PM, Crystal Dennis wrote:
>> >> Thanks for all the help guys.  I've been having issues with accessing
>> >> the preference windows even with the JAWS cursors and clicking star
>> >> and everything, and putting graphics on read all didn't do anything in
>> >> Eastwest.  I wasn't aware that this would be an issue with sinths, so
>> >> I am a little sad because I wanted to really use some orchestra
>> >> sinths:  The accessible ones I have right now are more dance sinths (I
>> >> have z3TA plus) I am currently on the hunt for any accessible
>> >> orchestra sinths, so any help with that would be appreciated.  I'm
>> >> also debating having a sighted friend just set it up for me, but it's
>> >> ashame that that has to be the solution to these sorts of problems
>> >> other than just buying a mac that has more on board accessibility lol.
>> >>
>> >> I will continue troubleshooting/testing sinths though, thanks
>> >> everyone!
>> >>
>> >> On 12/29/13, Indigo <33indigo at charter.net> wrote:
>> >>> Jackie, I once experimented with enabling audio devices and midi
>> >>> devices
>> >>> in Reaper with Wineyes 6.1, Jaws 10 and NVDA 2012.
>> >>> The method was very similar in each for routing disabled over to the
>> >>> number pad, focusing on it there, then pressing the star key for a
>> >>> right
>> >>> click to bring up the configuration dialog.
>> >>> I don't think its either easier or more difficult with any of those,
>> >>> and
>> >>> I didn't find any impossible moves in Reaper for those particular
>> >>> screenreaders.
>> >>>
>> >>> For making VST synths play that don't easily display their presets, I
>> >>> found it was hit and miss as to which screenreader displayed what
>> >>> interface parameters.
>> >>> Wineyes previous and next clip is the most useful screenreader move I
>> >>> found for locating elusive interface icons, but  I'm not skilled
>> >>> enough
>> >>> in Jaws to utilize all its potential in its numPad cursors, nor did I
>> >>> ever learn to use its OCR function.
>> >>> I don't know if anyone has yet found all that NVDA's object
>> >>> navigation
>> >>> can do, and I'm constantly surprised at what I can read with NVDA.
>> >>> On this online surfing computer I now have only NVDA and Google
>> >>> Chrome,
>> >>> which together move like a lightening boltaround web pages.
>> >>> Reaper itself dumps all automatable parameters is an awkward to use
>> >>> list, but I never found any of those listed parameters useful to get
>> >>> an
>> >>> uncooperative synth to expose its presets, so you can play them.
>> >>> Either by accident when roaming around the interface and left
>> >>> clicking,
>> >>> or with sighted help, I've got preset inc and dec arrows located, in
>> >>> several synths, like NI's Massive, FM8 and Absynth 5, plus Zebra,
>> >>> Nexus,
>> >>> and others; and found ways to get back to those preset buttons, which
>> >>> is
>> >>> at least miminal access.
>> >>> With as many accessible VST synths that are available, like Z3TA,
>> >>> which
>> >>> readily exposes all its presets, same with Gladiator,Firebird, and
>> >>> many
>> >>> others, one could say why frustrate oneself with uncooperative
>> >>> synths.
>> >>> Still, some synths sound so beautiful we get sucked into unraveling
>> >>> their puzzle.
>> >>> With me it's Camel Audio's Alchemy, which I have been working on for
>> >>> a
>> >>> couple of years now.
>> >>> Novation's AutoMap has been a blessing at getting every parameter of
>> >>> VST
>> >>> plugs onto hardware knobs and buttons, but it is no help at finding
>> >>> and
>> >>> navigating interface menus, dialogs, and other bit map  screen monkey
>> >>> puzzles one needs for total access.
>> >>> Indi
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> On 12/28/2013 4:31 PM, Jackie McBride wrote:
>> >>>> Unfortunately, Jaws 10 is pretty old & may not be picking up on
>> >>>> stuff
>> >>>> it needs to pick up on. Having said that, though, Crystall, there
>> >>>> are
>> >>>> some settings I'd advise u to change in Jaws. First, u should
>> >>>> consider
>> >>>> setting graphics to all--not labeled, & definitively not none. Also,
>> >>>> try going into your verbosity preferences & check to read the
>> >>>> tooltips. Lastly, try seeing what happens if u set jaws to follow
>> >>>> pc.
>> >>>> U might get some tooltips to read & be able to figure out what some
>> >>>> of
>> >>>> those unlabeled graphics do, & then u can label 'em. Unset that
>> >>>> option
>> >>>> when you're done, though, or it'll drive u absolutely nutso.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> U might also try NVDA & see if that provides any better results.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> On 12/28/13, Crystal Dennis <valkyriecelesyt at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>>>> I feel like that may be the problem:  I have gone into the
>> >>>>> preferences
>> >>>>> dialogues and can only see very sparce things with the JAWS cursor.
>> >>>>> In that case:  Does anyone know an accessible set of orchestra
>> >>>>> sinths
>> >>>>> I can test out?
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> On 12/28/13, Gianluca Apollaro <gianluca.apollaro88 at gmail.com>
>> >>>>> wrote:
>> >>>>>> Hi list,
>> >>>>>> if some synths are working and some other arn't it probably means
>> >>>>>> that
>> >>>>>> the not working ones have a non accessible interface and that you
>> >>>>>> have
>> >>>>>> to click on some graphics to make them load their sounds.
>> >>>>>> Hth,
>> >>>>>> Best regards,
>> >>>>>> Gianluca from Italy.
>> >>>>>> Skype Id: gianluca8815
>> >>>>>> Il 28/12/2013 04:46, Crystal Dennis ha scritto:
>> >>>>>>> Yeah and every other sinth is working, so I'm wondering if I
>> >>>>>>> should
>> >>>>>>> just try another package until I find one that works...
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> On 12/27/13, Drew <amockery at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>>>>>>> That is very odd. "Default" is, well, the default--in other
>> >>>>>>>> words
>> >>>>>>>> it's
>> >>>>>>>> a
>> >>>>>>>> shortcut that points to whatever you've set as your default
>> >>>>>>>> device.
>> >>>>>>>> If
>> >>>>>>>> there
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> are no devices, that's meaningless. You must have some sound
>> >>>>>>>> device
>> >>>>>>>> otherwise you would not be able to hear JAWS, but for it to not
>> >>>>>>>> show
>> >>>>>>>> up
>> >>>>>>>> is
>> >>>>>>>> quite strange.
>> >>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>> >>>>>>>> From: "Crystal Dennis" <valkyriecelesyt at gmail.com>
>> >>>>>>>> To: "Reapers Without Peepers" <rwp at reaaccess.com>
>> >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, December 27, 2013 7:16 PM
>> >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [RWP] Help with Sinth VSTs
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>> When I pull down the sound device menus I have:
>> >>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>> Primary Sound capture driver -- when Direct Sound is selected
>> >>>>>>>>> Microsoft Sound Mapper -- When Wave out is selected.
>> >>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>> those are the only 2 sound devices that show up and on midi I
>> >>>>>>>>> have:
>> >>>>>>>>> Microsoft Wavable Sinth Disabled (I tried right clicking and no
>> >>>>>>>>> menus
>> >>>>>>>>> came up at all....I'm also using JAWS 10)
>> >>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>> The only things I can't get working are the sound libraries, and
>> >>>>>>>>> I
>> >>>>>>>>> feel like there's something vital that I'm missing due to my
>> >>>>>>>>> newbe-ness in this subject....sorry if this is too many
>> >>>>>>>>> questions!
>> >>>>>>>>> But all I get are drop down menus in preferences, no way to
>> >>>>>>>>> right
>> >>>>>>>>> click anything even with the JAWS cursor
>> >>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>> On 12/27/13, Indigo <33indigo at charter.net> wrote:
>> >>>>>>>>>> Crystal, do you have a sound card that you installed into your
>> >>>>>>>>>> computer,
>> >>>>>>>>>> or is there only the RealTech sound chip?
>> >>>>>>>>>> If you have a third-party soundcard installed, or just
>> >>>>>>>>>> RealTech,
>> >>>>>>>>>> you
>> >>>>>>>>>> need to get it recognized in Reaper's preferences.
>> >>>>>>>>>> You can play VST synths using the RealTech chip, but with
>> >>>>>>>>>> large
>> >>>>>>>>>> delay
>> >>>>>>>>>> or
>> >>>>>>>>>> latency; between the moment you hit the note on the keyboard
>> >>>>>>>>>> and
>> >>>>>>>>>> the
>> >>>>>>>>>> moment you hear the note.
>> >>>>>>>>>> To get either your installed soundcard or the built in
>> >>>>>>>>>> RealTech
>> >>>>>>>>>> chip
>> >>>>>>>>>> enabled, press ctrl+P.
>> >>>>>>>>>> Then navigate to audio.
>> >>>>>>>>>> Then tab down to the field that shows either your soundcard,
>> >>>>>>>>>> or
>> >>>>>>>>>> RealTech, and get enabled; instead of Disabled, after its
>> >>>>>>>>>> name;
>> >>>>>>>>>> by
>> >>>>>>>>>> routing focus to the number pad.
>> >>>>>>>>>> The method will depend on your screenreader, but it's similar
>> >>>>>>>>>> in
>> >>>>>>>>>> Wineyes, Jaws and NVDA.
>> >>>>>>>>>> Then focus at the numPad on the soundcard's name, or Disabled.
>> >>>>>>>>>> Then right click at the number pad
>> >>>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>>> The Configure Dialog should appear.
>> >>>>>>>>>> Press enter on the Configure Dialog, and when it opens, place
>> >>>>>>>>>> checkmarks
>> >>>>>>>>>> on use as audio device, etcetera.
>> >>>>>>>>>> Then arrow down to Midi Device and follow the same procedure
>> >>>>>>>>>> for
>> >>>>>>>>>> the
>> >>>>>>>>>> inputs and outputs for midi.
>> >>>>>>>>>> Get Disabled routed over to the number Pad, then focus on the
>> >>>>>>>>>> soundcard's name or Disabled, then right click and you should
>> >>>>>>>>>> get
>> >>>>>>>>>> the
>> >>>>>>>>>> midi configuration Dialog.
>> >>>>>>>>>> Hit enter on it.
>> >>>>>>>>>> When it opens, place checkmarks with your spacebar on Use as
>> >>>>>>>>>> midi
>> >>>>>>>>>> device, etcetera.
>> >>>>>>>>>> Then tab down to OK and hit enter, and you'll be taken back to
>> >>>>>>>>>> the
>> >>>>>>>>>> track
>> >>>>>>>>>> view.
>> >>>>>>>>>> To get a synth to load, you need to install it in a folder, or
>> >>>>>>>>>> copy/paste its .dll into a folder, so Reaper can find it.
>> >>>>>>>>>> I keep all VST's in C:\Program Files\Steinberg\VSTPlugins
>> >>>>>>>>>> which,
>> >>>>>>>>>> if
>> >>>>>>>>>> I
>> >>>>>>>>>> typed it correctly, is the exact path to my synths folder.
>> >>>>>>>>>> To type in the path to where you are keeping VST plugIns,
>> >>>>>>>>>> press
>> >>>>>>>>>> ctrl+P,
>> >>>>>>>>>> then arrow down to VST, then tab down to where Reaper asks you
>> >>>>>>>>>> to
>> >>>>>>>>>> type
>> >>>>>>>>>> in a path to your VST plugIns.
>> >>>>>>>>>> Same here as when getting a soundcard enabled, be sure to
>> >>>>>>>>>> click
>> >>>>>>>>>> enter
>> >>>>>>>>>> on
>> >>>>>>>>>> OK before exiting.
>> >>>>>>>>>> To load a synth, press the letter F while on a selected track
>> >>>>>>>>>> and
>> >>>>>>>>>> the
>> >>>>>>>>>> load dialog opens.
>> >>>>>>>>>> Navigate with tab and arrows to the desired plugIn and hit
>> >>>>>>>>>> enter
>> >>>>>>>>>> on
>> >>>>>>>>>> it,
>> >>>>>>>>>> and it loads to the selected track.
>> >>>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>>> Now, while arrowed to the track with the loaded plug, tab and
>> >>>>>>>>>> you'll
>> >>>>>>>>>> get
>> >>>>>>>>>> various recording options.
>> >>>>>>>>>> Set monitor to Normal with your arrow keys, so you can hear
>> >>>>>>>>>> the
>> >>>>>>>>>> synth
>> >>>>>>>>>> play.
>> >>>>>>>>>> Be sure to hit enter to keep your settings.
>> >>>>>>>>>> I can't tell you what to set as the recording source, since
>> >>>>>>>>>> I've
>> >>>>>>>>>> never
>> >>>>>>>>>> used the virtual keyboard, and have no idea how to set up a
>> >>>>>>>>>> synth
>> >>>>>>>>>> to
>> >>>>>>>>>> play from virtual keyboard.
>> >>>>>>>>>> Sorry,
>> >>>>>>>>>> Indi
>> >>>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>>> On 12/26/2013 7:52 PM, Crystal Dennis wrote:
>> >>>>>>>>>>> Hi again!  I seriously need some help, so hopefully I came to
>> >>>>>>>>>>> the
>> >>>>>>>>>>> right place :)
>> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>>>> I have been using reaper for awhile, and I recently wanted to
>> >>>>>>>>>>> start
>> >>>>>>>>>>> composing my own music tracks with instrument sinths.  I'm
>> >>>>>>>>>>> using
>> >>>>>>>>>>> the
>> >>>>>>>>>>> virtual keyboard, and have downloaded a few sinth sets
>> >>>>>>>>>>> but...I
>> >>>>>>>>>>> have
>> >>>>>>>>>>> had this same problem with all of them:  They haven't been
>> >>>>>>>>>>> playing
>> >>>>>>>>>>> when I load the track into reaper!  Here's what I've been
>> >>>>>>>>>>> doing:
>> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>>>> - Installing the software (I've tried Eastwest and Miroslave
>> >>>>>>>>>>> Filharmonic with the same results for both - no audio)
>> >>>>>>>>>>> - Then I've tinkered with my audio device settings with no
>> >>>>>>>>>>> results.
>> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>>>> Now I am very, very new with dealing with sinths, so my
>> >>>>>>>>>>> questions
>> >>>>>>>>>>> are:
>> >>>>>>>>>>>      Do I need some new software that reaper doesn't have?  I
>> >>>>>>>>>>> don't
>> >>>>>>>>>>> have
>> >>>>>>>>>>> any Aceo drivers, could that be why?  or does the Virtual
>> >>>>>>>>>>> Keyboard
>> >>>>>>>>>>> just not work for all plugins...I've tried spicy guitar also
>> >>>>>>>>>>> and
>> >>>>>>>>>>> it
>> >>>>>>>>>>> doesn't play either.  Sound magics VSTs have worked for me,
>> >>>>>>>>>>> but
>> >>>>>>>>>>> that's
>> >>>>>>>>>>> about it really.  There's something that says 32 Out and 8
>> >>>>>>>>>>> Out
>> >>>>>>>>>>> next
>> >>>>>>>>>>> to
>> >>>>>>>>>>> some of the files, what does that mean?  Are there any other
>> >>>>>>>>>>> orchestra
>> >>>>>>>>>>> sinth packs that work better with Reaper I could try out?  I
>> >>>>>>>>>>> really
>> >>>>>>>>>>> just want to get something working because right now I have a
>> >>>>>>>>>>> ton
>> >>>>>>>>>>> of
>> >>>>>>>>>>> GB taken up with nothing to show for it.  So mainly I'm a
>> >>>>>>>>>>> noob
>> >>>>>>>>>>> with
>> >>>>>>>>>>> sinths who needs help!
>> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>>>> Sorry for this novel!  Any help would be greatly appreciated
>> >>>>>>>>>>> :)
>> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>>>> Crystal
>> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>>>>>>>>> RWP mailing list
>> >>>>>>>>>>> RWP at reaaccess.com
>> >>>>>>>>>>> http://reaaccess.com/mailman/listinfo/rwp_reaaccess.com
>> >>>>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>>>>>>>> RWP mailing list
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>> >>>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>>>>>>> RWP mailing list
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>> >>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>>>>> RWP mailing list
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>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>>>> RWP mailing list
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>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> _______________________________________________
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>> >>>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>> _______________________________________________
>> >>> RWP mailing list
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>> >>>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
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>> >>
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
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>> >
>>
>>
>> --
>> Sincerely,
>>
>> Keith
>> Home Phone:
>> 928-554-3936
>> Mobile Phone:
>> 928-713-6370
>> Primary email:
>> keithint1234 at gmail.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>
>

-- 
Sincerely,

Keith
Home Phone:
928-554-3936
Mobile Phone:
928-713-6370
Primary email:
keithint1234 at gmail.com