[RWP] autotuning in reaper?

Sun May 26 22:47:16 EDT 2013

When you guys work with AHK, have you found a convenient way to learn the 
mouse coords?  It seems that screwing around with that spy program is a bit 
unhandy.
What's the easy way to do that?

Yeah, I think AHK works only in terms of windows that have titles, and that 
may even come down to the foreground window, which is equivalent to the main 
application window.    I agree, I didn't see anything in there about tracing 
the family relationships to find child windows, etc.  So, you could not 
index tiny control windows, like a slider.
But, you can position relative to the main window.
For translating hotSpotClicker sets into an AHK equivalent, you could only 
translate those spots that are defined relative  to the app main window.
You'll end up relying on your screen reader a fair amount, since AHK 
apparently can not acquire text from the screen.  For that, you either need 
an off screen model, like jaws and window eyes,  or you need to obtain an 
object  from a mouse address, and get text from that object.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Chris Belle" <cb1963 at sbcglobal.net>
To: "Reapers Without Peepers" <rwp at reaaccess.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 26, 2013 7:50 PM
Subject: Re: [RWP] autotuning in reaper?

The only problem I see is that if your using positional information the
mouse graph will be dynamic, not the same, so how do you know from what
level you want to draw and to what level, you'd need an infinite number of
menu items.

When I did sessiondrummer3 for sonar
 luckily, clicking on the controls brought focus to the keyboard, but to
query what state or what value the controls were in, I used my
screen-reader.

You can pass variables with ahk, so if you can get any feedback from the
program itself, then this could be used.

Otherwise, it's going to be tricky.

But I love ahk, it is very powerful indeed, and
I'm going by memory but set title match mode should give you your child
windows.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "David P Shortland" <dragamilov at comcen.com.au>
To: "Reapers Without Peepers" <rwp at reaaccess.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 26, 2013 7:20 PM
Subject: Re: [RWP] autotuning in reaper?

Hi & Greetings from your future in Australia...

AHK has commands that can read Window Titles, Window Start Co-Ords (i.e. the
upper left corner of the window), and also gives the size of the window x by
y... It can bring windows to the front, send windows to the back, chekc
which windows are doing what and so on.

What I have not found yet is to do with Parent/Child windows... my thoughts
at present it just really looks at the window that has focus... the one on
top...

It has the ability to read and write from files, manipulate that data...
open and close files or open and close programs if it comes to that...

It can be set up to do Macros... one key command can do a list of
actions...there is no limitations to this.

It has Timers, can reference the clock in your computer, or really can be
set up to reference whatever yu like...

As I mentioned in my last email about AHK, I use the GUI command to generate
my own browser for Omnisphere... which if you Select say the Category
PolySynth, when next you come back to this window PolySynth is still
selected... just like in the Omnisphere Browser...

Tis the manipulation of the Mouse in the background that does not really
present a great hastlebut needs to work correctly...

I have been told that only six items are visible in the Browser for each
column, so it is setting up the routines to scroll the Mouse Wheel up and
down relative to where you currently are to get what you want...I currently
use a routine that sets the Default of the column back to the top to achieve
what is desired...not sure though if this is the right way to go, back
currently tis working...

I believe that AHK is very powerful and could be a great tool for us, some
of us just need to get our collective heads around it and well who knows...

There was some talk in the forums at one stage about the possibility of
having some sort of OCR implementation, but as yet it is nowhere up to any
sort of usability for us... but it is there in the worx...

If I get a little time today ..*joke*...I will have a look at the idea of
using AHK to manipulate the Mouse to draw the curves for our Automation
issues.I say this because I know that you can control the Mouse Speed as
well as direction Left, Right & Middle Buttons, even for more Buttons if
your mouse has them... so in reality here's the thought...

1. Select the Track you wish to do your Automation on... the easy part
2. Select from a list what you want to Automate... say Pan Volume, FX
Reverbs etc
3. Select from a list of Curves say Linear, Exponential up, exponential
down, inverse or draw your own
4. Depending on your Selections from above when it comes time in your
project to start the Automation AHK goes away and does its thing from a
simple KeyCommand...

Now I am not saying this will be as easy as making a sandwich, but the tools
are all there at our fingertips and I do not believe it would be that hard
to implement...

Just some thoughts...

Have a great day all...

David P Shortland
DragonScore Productions

-----Original Message----- 
From: Jim Snowbarger
Sent: Monday, May 27, 2013 6:59 AM
To: Reapers Without Peepers
Subject: Re: [RWP] autotuning in reaper?

Steve,
You can definitely read .hsc files with AHK.
It would be cool to write an HSC interpreter in AHK land.  I think reading
the file is the eay part.  The harder part is finding the window you want
when it doesn't have a title, and getting the boundaries of that window, so
you can index with hS coordinates.
I'm pretty sure all that is possible, and would be a wonderful way to
capitalize on work already done.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Steve Spamer" <steve at vipaudioaccess.com>
To: "'Reapers Without Peepers'" <rwp at reaaccess.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 26, 2013 6:09 AM
Subject: Re: [RWP] autotuning in reaper?

David, sounds as if you're doing a great job there, keep at it. It's not
easy work and like you say, very frustrating at times!  We have big
obstacles with the DAW and program we use, but in one respect, the bigger
issue is understanding a plugs environment without being able to see it.  I
made plenty of mistakes when doing Omnisphere, thinking I knew how things
worked at the time, but slowly things come together...and that's hopefully
what you're experiencing.  I remember thinking I'd cracked the categories,
then found out only a certain amount are visible at a time and the user had
to scroll to see the rest...oh gees, another 150+ categories popped up!...it
was time to reassess and think again lol.

Regarding feedback, and this depends on how far you're going to go with
Omnisphere and AHK, I mean you will reach a point where knowing where you
are in the plug is very important, the same with knowing whether or not a
button is actave etc.  It's easy to get lost in a myriad of keystrokes,
menus,  etc etc, so with screenreader feedback, we can keep on top of things
without having to remember "if I press this, then that  etc"...

I don't currently know of a way to  utilize NVDA's engine, but I'm sure I
will some day, but for now I know how to call SAPI to report to me whether a
control is on or off for example.  I think once the majority of tools we can
use with AHK have been highlighted and become more familiar, then things
could really pick up.  One thing that does intrigue me is that AHK can read
/write files, so wondering what could be gleamed from existing HSC sets,
probably too advanced for me lol, but you never know.

One thing I do know though, is you have to do it for personal gain and
enjoyment from a plug...as Jim has said, the work involved does not pay, but
I can get a real buzz from a user who is working with a plug that they
otherwise couldn't use...all down to what I've done...and in turn that's
possible because of the god that's Jim Snowbarger, don't blush Jim lol.
Cheers Steve.
P.S. Yes, you're right 3 browsers, but don't forget the sound source browser
has 1 for sound source A and 1 for sound source B, HTH.
Visit:
www.vipaudioaccess.com
for audio access solutions, articles, demos, to showcase your music and  to
basically get involved!
-----Original Message-----
From: RWP [mailto:rwp-bounces at reaaccess.com] On Behalf Of David P Shortland
Sent: 26 May 2013 06:21
To: Reapers Without Peepers
Subject: Re: [RWP] autotuning in reaper?

Hi & Greetings from Sunday afternoon on the Sunshine Coast

Okay firstly, if anyone has a problem with discussing AHK matters on this
REAPER forum just say so and I will take it off list and talk to Steve
directly.

You are correct in saying that AHK is a complete programming environment and

sometimes it just goes on and on with what it can do...

The trouble is that with most programming environments the people who right
them and then the subsequent documentation is actually written for
programmers and not for us lesser mortals...*chuckle*. That is most of the
examples they give, and I must say they give plenty of examples, just go
right over my head. Mayhap, I am just a mere dummy...*chuckle*

However, when it comes to my skills with AHK so far, and I may add, tis
truly very minor in the grand scheme of things, I have been dabbling with
colour matchingfor feedback concerning the browsers that I have been wanting

to access. What this means is that when the browsers are open the screen is
a certain colour in a specific location and that colour is different when
the browser is closed. As I say, I am just dabbling and I am not sure if
this is really what is necessary, but I can only do what I have been able to

glean from the documentation.

Actually I only thought there were three browsers, the first being the
MultiBrowser, the second being the PatchBrowser and the third being the
SampleWaveformBrowser.

My current way of accessing the PatchBrowser is to of written my own browser

which comes up in a window each category is in a drop down list and each
menu item then gives rise to the next column/window and so on until you get
down to your presets...
I then have a co-ord that places me at the top of the Patch/Preset list
which has been sorted as the windows do their thing... I can then use the
normal cursor keys, up and down to navigate the list.

My partner, bless her little cotton sox, has been my eyes for all testing,
and sometimes had to endure my bursts of frustration as 9 times out of 10
matters do not go as expected...

In the back of my mind are the words ... Patience ... Persistance ...
Patience ... Persistence...

If this is really going to go anywhere, I need to start looking at setting
some time aside just for AHK, but where in the 24 hours a day we are granted

do I do that...

Then there is STILL ...all the REAPER stuff....

Take care all...

David P Shortland
DragonScore Productions

-----Original Message----- 
From: Steve Spamer
Sent: Saturday, May 25, 2013 8:30 PM
To: 'Reapers Without Peepers'
Subject: Re: [RWP] autotuning in reaper?

Well done David, nice to hear.  Just interested, but how are you getting
feedback from AHK?  I'm working with AHK and SAPI at the moment, so
wondering if you're using another approach or not bothering.  Omnisphere has
a vast amount of windows and clicking in the wrong one could really bugger
things up, like in the browsers...which browser have you made accessible, as
there are 4 different browsers?  I'm tempted to dip into converting a set I
have done with HSC, but I really need to grasp the core functions and nuts
and bolts of AHK before doing so.

I'm using a plug as a test bed for AHK and am pleased so far, but there's
much to understand if I'm going to do things proprerly, at the moment it
works, but I'm sure the code could be more efficient etc. It's all a
learning curve...and time is the biggest killer, not having enough, well,
not enough time for the learning to sink in and stick.

I've been impressed with AHK and what it's possibilities are, but I don't
yet have the skills to be able to utilize it, even if I have the ideas on
how to achieve an objective.  It really is a programming environment...HSC
has the specific and direct functions to work with, so reaching an objective
is a matter of embracing virtually all of what it has to offer.  Also, don't
forget having Mr Snowman's support is invaluable when problems are
encountered, which is inevitable., Another thing is I've found the forums on
AHK don't yield good results, unless you're asking something about  AHK
which is complex...a simple question doesn't seem to get answered, well
that's my experience so far.  One problem I'm experiencing, is it has so
many aspects that are not relevant to us as VIP's and what we're trying to
achieve, so it's a matter of understanding enough to know what is useful and
what we need to concentrate on...and what we don't need to. Cheers Steve.

Visit:
www.vipaudioaccess.com
for audio access solutions, articles, demos, to showcase your music and  to
basically get involved!

-----Original Message-----
From: RWP [mailto:rwp-bounces at reaaccess.com] On Behalf Of David P Shortland
Sent: 24 May 2013 21:26
To: Reapers Without Peepers
Subject: Re: [RWP] autotuning in reaper?

Hi & Greetings from The Sunshine Coast

Omnisphere is completely inaccessable I believe for all ScreenReaders.

I have been slowly putting together an AHK Set for this virtual synth, but
unfortunately music production takes precedence over learning and writing
AHK material.

So far though, I can now access the browser with all its categories, the
search field, and the program/preset list.., and have started work on the
Parts Section...

I must say though that Omnisphere is an incredible synth...

Take care all

David P Shortland
DragonScore Productions

-----Original Message----- 
From: Patrick Perdue
Sent: Friday, May 24, 2013 6:46 PM
To: Reapers Without Peepers
Subject: Re: [RWP] autotuning in reaper?

David:
How are you using Omnisphere with System Access? I haven't tried it yet
myself, though I want to, but I was under the impression that you
couldn't do much without lots of hotspots from HSC.

On 5/24/2013 4:40 AM, Chris Belle wrote:
> That vst stability is something they may have finally addressed in the
> later versions.
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "David P Shortland"
> <dragamilov at comcen.com.au>
> To: "Reapers Without Peepers" <rwp at reaaccess.com>
> Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2013 4:48 PM
> Subject: Re: [RWP] autotuning in reaper?
>
>
> Hi & Greetings from Queensland
>
> Just to put the other side of the coin...
>
> I run REAPER 64 Version 4.402 on Windoes7 with System Access
>
> Never had any trouble whatsoever with REAPER not scanning any the VST
> directories.
>
> I rund both 32 and 64 bit plugs and the only one REAPER has trouble with
> has
> been Dimension Pro....
>
>  From Spectrasonics Omnisphere to Alchemy, Garritan Personal Orchestra to
> Ivory2 and even the Korg Legacy Collection all perform as expected...
>
> I can usually get Dimension Pro to work but I Have to do a little
> AltTabbing
> etc, to finally get the window to show properly, but once in place with
> AHK
> can effectively get to the Programs that it has
>
> And that is just the Virtual Synths... Nomad Factories Blue Tubes and
> Tone2
> WarmVerb a few Izotope plugs, plus several other 32bit fx plugs ... all
> are
> scanned and show up without hassle.
>
> Just as an aside, the computer that I use in my studio is dedicated to
> music
> production. I run System Access from a USB drive, but have installed
> NVDA as
> a BackUp.
>
> It never goes on the net, nor does it have any other programs that need to
> be there other than System Essentials...
>
> That's it
>
> Take care all
>
> David P Shortland
> DragonScore Productions
>
>
>
> -----Original Message----- From: Chris Belle
> Sent: Wednesday, May 22, 2013 7:22 AM
> To: Reapers Without Peepers
> Subject: Re: [RWP] autotuning in reaper?
>
> Another issue with reaper, which for all it's promise I always had trouble
> with the vst implementation, and plug-in scanning in general.
>
> Not as stable as we would like.
>
> But it's still early days for reaper.
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Indigo" <33indigo at charter.net>
> To: "Reapers Without Peepers" <rwp at reaaccess.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, May 21, 2013 9:11 AM
> Subject: Re: [RWP] autotuning in reaper?
>
>
> I just pasted the GSnap dll into Reaper 64's VST destination folder;
> which is Steinberg\VSTPlugins on this computer; , and; running NVDA; I
> couldn't get Reaper 64 to even load GSnap.
> I ran Reaper's Clear Cache Rescan several times; which is Reaper's  most
> extreme method of forceing it to recognize a plug, no luck.
> I couldn't find a 64 bit version of GSnap that's labeled as for 64 bit
> Windows; unless maybe the plug is assumed to be for both 32 and 64 bits.
> Online, I read forum posts from folks running GSnap in Reaper 64, so
> don't understand why it won't load.
> Thanks for any reports of your experience with it,
> Indi
>
> On 5/21/2013 5:21 AM, Steve Spamer wrote:
>> Regarding GSnap, Tim Burgess has an HSC file for it over at:
>> http://www.raisedbar.net/articles.htm
>> but not sure if it will be of any use, as most on here are NVDA users.
>> Anyway, it may be handy, cheers
>> Steve
>>
>> Visit:
>> www.vipaudioaccess.com
>> for audio access solutions, articles, demos, to showcase your music
>> and to
>> basically get involved!
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: RWP [mailto:rwp-bounces at reaaccess.com] On Behalf Of Indigo
>> Sent: 20 May 2013 23:43
>> To: Reapers Without Peepers
>> Subject: Re: [RWP] autotuning in reaper?
>>
>> I used GSnap with Window-Eyes in 32 bits.
>> I suppose bridge intends to somehow bridge something to 64 bit windows 7.
>> What did you do when bridge came up?
>> Would none of it talk?
>> Did you try route to focus numPad insert and the numpad -minus key?
>> Did you try numPad insert and the 7 key?
>> Sorry, NVDA doesn't cover everything, unfortunately.
>> What's accessible in Wineyes or Jaws may not be, and vice versa.
>> Indi
>>
>>
>> On 5/20/2013 4:33 PM, Oriol Gómez wrote:
>>> Hi Indi,
>>> Thanks for your email.
>>> You mean gSnap is accessible' I just tried it and it came up with
>>> something called gSnap bridge, which was a window that NVDA did not
>>> recognize at all.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 5/20/13, Indigo <33indigo at charter.net> wrote:
>>>> Hi Oriol,
>>>> The VST pitch-correcting plugs  here work, and are free.
>>>> They're simpler than Antares AutoTune, but make the same Cher Effect,
>>>> which I also like very much.
>>>> The top free plug on the list definitely is accessible, and I think the
>>>> second on the list is also, but it's been a while since I tried it.
>>>> Don't know if scripts are available, or needed; since they're very
>> simple.
>>>> They're freeware VST plugs, and do pitch correction when a track's
>>>> output is fed through them, and I seem to remember that the pitch
>>>> can be
>>>> set from playing notes on a midi keyboard as well.
>>>> Indi
>>>>
>>
http://bedroomproducersblog.com/2011/07/25/bpb-freeware-studio-best-free-pit
>>
>> ch-correction-auto-tune-vstau-plugins/
>>>>
>>>> On 5/20/2013 8:23 AM, Oriol Gómez wrote:
>>>>> Hello everyone,
>>>>> I'm looking to add some autotuning to one of my songs because I like
>>>>> the metallic effect that it gives it. Is reaTune an option?
>>>>> I don't know if it is accessible, I have tried loading the reaTune
>>>>> plugin but it seems not to be completely accessible as I can't switch
>>>>> from manual tuning to autotune with NVDA.
>>>>> Does anyone have any hints? Is there a more accessible workaround?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks!
>>>>> Oriol.
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> RWP mailing list
>>>>> RWP at reaaccess.com
>>>>> http://reaaccess.com/mailman/listinfo/rwp_reaaccess.com
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>
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>>
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